Still a Chance to win a FREE copy of Electric Angel!

Yes, I do understand that the blog you have to go to is most likely the LAST place you thought you'd see me doing an interview. But I have readers from this "closed" market and I can't get to them through the venues that matter because I DON'T write specifically for the "discriminating" publishers that supply them with fiction.



Lena Nelson Dooley is one of the FEW bloggers/authors who will even humor me so I can let those fans know I've a new book out. Y'all don't have to like that sort of fiction to post (I know I don't.) You don't even have to agree with the way these targeted Christian publishers do business (again, I know I don't.) BUT go load my interview down with comments so it will keep those readers looking. Love y'all!!!



Here's the link: LenaNelsonDooley.blogspot.com



And yes, I still write general market horror/fantasy etc . . . Yeah! Yeah!



Go over there and talk up Zombies and werewolves and vampires. That should do it. LOL

Mainstream Christian Fiction?

Why can't the "evangelical" publishing houses come up with a name? EGADS! They came out of the gate in 1950 abusing the label "Christian" fiction when the work they put out (according to their own words) was "targeted" fiction for their store visitors ONLY (the then Baptist Bookstores and now Lifeway, Mardel's etc . . .) and not fiction that would appeal to ALL readers who fit under the umbrella Christian. Even today they mark their demographic as evangelicals and SOME Catholics. Not sure what that is about. Weird huh?





The label seems to be mutating now into ALL kinds of different things to thoroughly confuse anyone who is interested. Here are some examples:



Edgy Christian Fiction

Mainstream Christian Fiction

Family Friendly Fiction



and the list goes on and on and on with new ones popping up every day.



What's wrong with just picking a name and sticking with it? Can you imagine if Harlequin had the same problem? LOL We might be seeing markets like:



Mainstream Romance Almost

Scripted Romance

The First Kiss Always Happens on Page 32 Romance

Romance You Don't Have to Predict So You Can Enjoy the Story



But Harlequin doesn't have this problem. Their branding says it all. They have a HUGE readership and will keep it because some folk LOVE that style of writing. Take note "evangelical" publishers. PLEASE! You're driving me crazy.



And for the record, if C. S. Lewis actually started his writing career today, no Christian publisher would take him but of course he would soar in the general market as that's the market he wrote for. I suspect he'd be as ardently against such publishers being wishy-washy about their branding as I am. I suspect he'd be more like William P. Young in telling them to buzz off once they actually came to him after turning him down BEFORE his "own" marketing efforts garnished him a significant number of sales.

I SAID Interview up!!!

LOL Aw, I know it's early but do go check out my answers to Lena Nelson Dooley's interview questions. This is a very popular blog among those who enjoy the fiction put out by publishers who serve that very targeted demographic of Christians that I don't write for but appeal to.



Here's the link: Lena Nelson Dooley's Blog



Lena is one of the few bloggers who humor authors who come through general market publishers so let her know y'all appreciate it. I do because it's one of the RARE opportunities I have to reach those readers as most of the venues won't even list work from authors who don't write targeted fiction much less talk about them AND let them speak their mind!



Lena rawks!



Now go let her know it. ;)



You're incentive . . . you could win a copy of Electric Angel from just posting.

Spring Arbor Bound.

Yes, my publisher confirmed that Never Ceese and Electric Angel have both been submitted to Ingram's Spring Arbor for approval (at my request.) Never Ceese was once approved by Spring Arbor already but I pulled it because I felt that my work showing up on sites selling books specifically for that "targeted" Christian market (that so many folks shun and for good reason) wasn't really all that good for me.



HOWEVER, I have many readers from that market that deserve to be exposed to something very different and so I've taken the plunge once more since they seem to like my work. Doesn't mean I won't still be bullied or rather not allowed on blogs where "targeted" Christian fiction is being pushed as general market fiction or treated like a dog in a cat show when it comes to awards I'd possibly stand a chance at winning if the rules were actually designed to consider all general market work as opposed to only work put out by publishers who provide fiction for that "targeted" Christian market but that's -- okay. ;)



Do keep in mind I consider Spring Arbor a very bad joke as they massage the theory proposed by CBA and ECPA that CBA and ECPA are "THE" Christian market when they can't possibly be since they only provide fiction for a very specific demographic of Christiandome (though they now include SOME Catholics or so it says on their site CBA.org Whatever that means.)



So when my books show up on these sites just know it's so those readers that like to support these sites (I don't but it's about making your work available, right) can order my books. Funny thing is that even though Spring Arbor approval is "supposed" to make your work available to "the" Christian market, unless you write "targeted" Christian fiction for that ONE demographic, you won't show up on sites that really get the sales ie . . .www.ChristianBook.com because they only pull from CBA and ECPA's database and not Spring Arbor. It's their way of discriminating and they just keep getting away with it. It's sad but that's life I suppose. All the large Christian Bookstores like Lifeway and Mardel's are the same way, not that many shop there for their fiction anyway because they've already learned, but no, they don't automatically carry books approved for their market by Spring Arbor. They still go to CBA and ECPA ONLY and occasionally non-affiliated publishers whose work is just as "targeted."



Please let anyone and everyone know that I only ever write general market (whatever genre I choose) and not for any "targeted" market at this time. If I do choose to write "targeted" fiction for any market, you'll know what market I'm targeting. Why wouldn't I tell you that? That's the entire purpose of writing "targeted" anything. Good Grief!

Hachette Book Groups Christian Division

As I continue on my publishing journey, I like to keep authors informed about what I've learned as knowing and understanding the different markets can keep you from wasting precious time and yes, even money.

As one can learn from reading previous post, I'm very interested in getting my work into bookstores where my Christian readers shop. I'm not all that interested in getting into the larger Christian booksellers however as I've come to learn they've only ever shelved books produced by publishers affiliated with the two gatekeeper organizations they created, CBA and ECPA. At least, that's the way things have gone here in the U.S. They do now take non-affiliated publishers work now IF the book is denominationally slanted toward the evangelical side of writing.

An interesting trend seems to have developed over the past few years though. When Ingram aquired Spring Arbor, CBA and ECPA's only distributor at the time, they began to allow non-affiliated Christian books into distribution. The larger Christian Booksellers almost immediately balked at this and even stopped carrying some affiliated books seemingly questioning the very organizations they created.

As a result, the Christian publishing industry, originally defined by CBA and ECPA affiliated product, began to open up. And finally we have readers recognizing that there is more to Christian publishing than books provided by a very large niche market.

Here's how Hachette books tries to "unconfuse" things. I've added a bit after each FAQ based on what I've learned. Again, just my opinion based on my experiences so far.


Hachette Book Group FAQ to read the FAQ in its entirety.

Christian Division of Hachette Book Group

Why did Hachette Book Group start a Christian publishing program?

Some of the country's most popular books in recent years have been Christian titles. The Left Behind Series (40 million copies sold) and The Prayer of Jabez (10 million copies sold) have dominated secular bestseller lists. Christian authors like Jan Karon, Jerry Jenkins, John C. Maxwell, T. D. Jakes, and Bruce Wilkinson have huge followings. Their books are carried by mainstream retailers as well as Christian bookstores. As a result, several New York houses have entered this market.

Sue's input: Just keep in mind when the term Christian title is used here it refers to titles put out for the specific Christian market CBA and ECPA serve only (evangelicals, Baptist and now "some" Catholics according to CBA's market definition on their site.) All the books mentioned were not written for the general market. And yes, they were carried by mainstream retailers but are usually mixed in with the general market books and sometimes in the Christian section the larger bookstores now provide. Niche market books mixed in with general market books. Very confusing.

Why does Hachette Book Group have a separate division for Christian titles?
Publishing books for the Christian audience is similar in many ways to publishing for the general audience. The editorial, marketing and sales functions operate in much the same way, but there are many subtle differences. First, the editorial content requires an understanding of Christian theology and worldview. Christian books, even novels, emphasize a spiritual message and context. Second, Christian titles are also marketed through religious media (television, radio and periodicals). Third, Christian books are sold in religious bookstores, in addition to general market retailers. There are approximately 2,000 Christian stores nationwide, most of whom belong to the Christian Booksellers Association (CBA). Thus, separate editorial, marketing and sales expertise and focus are needed to reach this audience.

Sue's input: Whose theology and worldview? Up until recently, only the theology and worldview of folks who visit Christian Bookstores. Targeted fiction until the merge of Ingram/Spring Arbor. Christian books are sold in religious bookstores but the larger Christian booksellers only shelf titles produced by CBA and ECPA publishers. Oddly enough, they are accepting titles from large CBA affiliated authors who are now publishing through Center Street who is not a member of CBA or ECPA. How bizarre is that? Karen Kingsbury and Ted Dekker are two examples. I haven't seen it happen yet where a previously unaffiliated Christian author published by Center Street got onto the shelf of a bigger Christian Book Store so I can't really comment further on that. So far it just seems Center Street is tying to gain noteriety by publishing a few successful CBA authors. That's just my take.

Does Hachette Book Group use a separate imprint for its Christian books?

Books that are specifically and exclusively written for Christian audiences are identified with the FaithWords imprint. However, many Christian authors today are writing for a broader audience and those books are published under the Center Street or Hachette Book Group imprints. The determination is based on the content and intended audience of the manuscript. In addition, Hachette Book Group has the Walk Worthy Press imprint for the Christian African American market.

Sue's input: Thus Faithwords is Hatchette Books CBA imprint. Many Christians authors today are writing for a broader audience? Many Christian authors have always been writing for a broader audience so why cator to them now? I won't share my input here.

Who handles Hachette Book Group's sales into the Christian retail market?

There was no real answer here. Just a number you could call but unless the world is spinning in a different direction and I completely misunderstood the question Spring Arbor will be handling Hatchette Book Group's sales to the Christian retail market. That's what they do.

Another very interesting thing I learned is that Hatchette Books actually created an Imprint from William Young's Windblown Media. I know I'm confused now. LOL What market will this be for?

Also Center Street on their about me page claims they are a general market publisher. In their FAQ they elaborate that Center Street is actually publishing for the broader Christian market. In the whole schem of things, General Market and Broader Christian Market are in most cases two very different audiences.

Okay, back to your regularly scheduled blog reading. *and that's for the one or two who actually read what I write. :)

I suppose I should feel honored?

Well it seems that when you become a grand author such as myself, meaning that if your name shows up on the internet more than a few times, before long you MIGHT be asked to give a book endorsement. I must say that I've had a few ask already but so far only from authors who are writing for the targeted market of Christians that CBA (a trade association who charge publishers a fee to belong and writes exclusive "Christian" fiction) serves.

WHY?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Do these authors NOT read my blogs? Do they NOT read anything about me. Why would I ever endorse a book written for a targeted market I've NO interest in reading?????? Do you think I'm going to suddenly LIKE the agenda based, restrictive and awkward writing styles?

No! I won't! EVER!!!!!! I don't write for that market and while I see nothing wrong with creating stories for targeted markets, I DO see very much wrong with NOT sharing who your target market is and claiming a broad label to identify your work with thus making things so very confusing.

EGADS!!!!!

Do your homework!!!! My stories often have the label Christian attached to them because my stories boast a theme that appeals to CBA readers. That certainly doesn't mean I write the kind of fiction those publishers put out.

Furthermore, if you knew anything about me you'd know not to ask for an endorsement if you're writing for that targeted market. So maybe you're new to all this and don't know this about me. Fair enough. But a little googling will set you straight right away.

Really! I promise you it will.

I am NOT the one to ask for endorsements if you write for an affiliated publisher or a publisher who targets that CBA or ECPA audience. I can assure you of this!

Interesting article about CBA member bookstores!

This article I found is certainly interesting to me since so many who are members of the Christian Booksellers Association, a fee-based trade organization, like to claim at every turn that member stores do represent and carry fiction that all manner of Christian would find appealing. This is one of those rare moments when they confess that they aren't THE Christian market but a segment of a much broader market.

I can hear the Titanic creaking even as I read.

Interesting article here.

OMG! Amazon did something right--for now!!!

Yes, that's right and it's sooooo difficult for me to believe that after months of my attempting to tell Amazon that I DID NOT want to support authors who write for publishers who discriminate denominationally and outright claim their books are the only books that are "Christian" by having their books bundled with mine. . . Amazon finally fixed things. A Thomas Nelson book is no longer bundled with mine!!!! Hallalujah and thank you Jesus! Merry Christmas to me! One small step but a HUGE one for me. I don't write for the closed and IMO closed-minded CBA/ECPA market and I don't believe in claiming that one denomination is the "official" Christian market.

YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY!!!!

Success for now!

You'll find my work in the general market with all the other true writers who are Christian of one variety or another. ;D

New entry on Publishing Industry page

I've made a new entry on my publishing industry page if you're interested in that sort of information. ;) Here's an easy way to see it. Here's the link!

Boy do I get asked this a lot!

Boy do I get this question a lot. Why the choice not to list your books with Christian retailers?

Let me just say that I won't answer this question completely as the full answer will come in my interview to be posted in Written in Blood next year. I will say that I never had a choice to list or not to list books with "Christian" retailers or rather CBA or ECPA affiliated "Christian" bookstores as they only place heavily targeted niche market books that come through a fee-paying CBA/ECPA affiliated publisher like Zondervan, Thomas Nelson, Bethany House, Tyndale, Harvest House (far too many to list.) These niche market and discriminative bookstores, once Baptist Bookstores, never planned on putting anything other than books from affiliated publishers on their shelves.

Believe it or not, though this seems like a thorough answer, it isn't!!!

Wait to read the entire answer in Written in Blood coming out May 2011. ;)

Side note: This is why I get so irritated each time I see affiliated books listed alongside mine. None of my publishers discriminate and neither do I. Don't list my book with those from publishers who do discriminate. *Sue makes her best angry face!*

And this is too funny. Right after I posted this, an ad came up on my sidebar for having your "Christian" book published through Xilibris. LOLROFL GIVE IT A REST!!!

*Sue shakes head back and forth* Choice? There is no choice. You'll only get listed with CBA/ECPA "Christian" retailiers (the predominant and sadly discriminating market) if you PAY to belong and write with in resrictive denominational guidelines with the exception of a very few non-affiliated publishers who produce very targeted work but don't pay to belong. And when I say few, I mean you can count them on your finger. I'm not saying which finger either. HA! Be nice. ;)

HorrorFind 12! Be there or be sorry.

HorrorFind 12 *The Sppokiest Show on Earth* in Gettysburg, Pennsylvania starts Friday September 3rd. Sue Dent (that would be me) will pick-up world renowned horror author Nicholas Grabowsky for the ride up in my mini-hearse. There will be a meet and greet with Black Bed Sheet Book authors (you may go to www.downarden.com to learn more.

I'll be there promoting Electric Angel and selling copies of Never Ceese and Forever Richard hoping to get rid of some books before BBS prints the special editions.

Come one, come all.

To my readers from that niche market CBA/ECPA serve I'd like to say that like the original versions of Never Ceese and Cyn No More, these books will not come through a CBA or ECPA affiliated "Christian" publisher as they don't publish horror. That means you still won't find these books in "Christian" bookstores as they only carry work by fee-paying affiliated publishers or non-fee paying publishers whose fiction is very denominationally targeted.

Also I won't seek to have these versions approved for distribution to the "Christian" market as it's a waste of time and energy. The good news is you'll be able to find my books everywhere else in the world.

For my general market readers, please don't pay any attention when books from CBA/ECPA niche market publishers show up as being bought with mine. I can't seem to keep this from happening. It's very disappointing at best as it cast a dim light on the quality of my work.

Here's a little video to get you in the mood:



But yes do come to HorrorFind and let's chat!!!! ;)

For free! I know, right?

So read on:

Andrea Dean Van Scoyoc, author of magnificently twisted horror and practicing witch and suprisingly saintly Sue Dent whose horror has been approved for distribution to the Christian market, (undeniably the oddest pairing of authors to join forces to date,) have arrived on the scene to help YOU, free of charge without any obligation based on our experiences to date, (which oddly enough seem to be EXACTLY the same.)

Take advantage of our little free offer to give you advise and you'll undoubtedly succeed on some level. Ignore us and we go away. Truly though, are the two of us that easy to ignore! I think not.

Here's the link to my first discussion. Make or break. Do join in!

Your salvation to being published or recognizing what it means to be published.

And now for part 3 of my interview with the Christian Examiner.

Part 3 of my interview with Christian Examiner is now up here. Thank you Shelly Ring for giving me the time of day when so many don't. With people like you helping get the word out, I just might swing making a living as a writer. Time will tell I suppose. 

I don't want to mislead anyone though. Appealing to the audience CBA and ECPA affiliated publishers serve has not helped me at all. If anything, it's made things much more difficult. I have to explain to my main audience that I don't write for this group, that they just happen to enjoy my work otherwise general market readers won't touch my work at all. And to top it all off, CBA market readers who do read my work can't even find my stories where they shop because I don't pay to be affiliated with CBA or ECPA. 

It's slightly devasting when an author and publisher has so little control over how their work is categorized. So once again, I don't write for the CBA or ECPA market though I love each and everyone of their readers who've enjoyed my work. I wouldn't mind writing for a CBA or ECPA affilaited publisher but they have all turned me down. And since they do produce work for a very tight niche market of Christians and not all readers of faith, I dare say something would have to change before I'd accept a contract from them should one happen to fall out of the sky and hit me on the head. *Sue is so not worried about this happening she doesn't even look up or cover her head. LOL*

But yes thank you Shelly Ring! You so rock!

So pleased with these interviews. :)

Shelly Ring of the Christian Examiner posted part two of her interview with me just now. When you get a chance do go read it.

The link.

With Never Ceese being self-published, I need all the help I can get getting out there. Thank you so much Shelly.

For interested publishers.

Disregard this blog. LOL It suggests that larger publishers actually see blogs from a peon like me and . . . well, that just isn't the case. I apologize for taking up cyber space with the ridiculous suggestion that they might. ;)

For interested publishers (I realize there are no interested publishers but I did want to get the info out there) I'll entertain all offers should anyone be interested in making one. My current publisher is wonderful yet hard times seem to affect us all. I need help promoting. The distribution my current publisher offers is grand, (and traditional so that rocks,) but it takes more than that to get the attention of readers. On my own accord I continue to promote and to take chances in hopes of hitting pay dirt or to simply just make a living writing. Yes, I'm having some success, a drop in the bucket as far as that goes. I love writing and will continue providing stories to those interested in reading them. However, I will reconsider the "making a living writing" mentality if no help is offered soon. Please do not read this as a call for sympathy, it's not that. Just letting anyone who might be interested know that any offer will be entertained. ;)

Oh yeah, you can use the e-mail associated with this blog. Now don't all ya'll respond at once!

Wow. I found this mind boggling.

I saw an author asking for votes on their book for CSPA (Christian Small Press Association) book of the year. I rushed over to see about joining this association as I'd forgotten about them and thought I might find some help here with promotions or what not. I went to their FAQ page and read this:

What do you define as the “Christian Marketplace”?

CSPA defines the Christian Marketplace as that marketplace that is served by CBA member retail stores – mainly individuals who hold to Catholic or Protestant beliefs and doctrines.

I wonder if they know that no small press can get their Christian books in a CBA member retail store because most all small press books are non-affiliated. They can't afford to pay nor do they meet or want to write within CBA and ECPA's strigent, restrictive guidelines put in place to protect their core market readers.

Amazing that this is how they define the Christian Marketplace. And CBA member stores only recently started allowing "some" Catholic publishers to become members.

Makes you wonder if there is any real help for small press Christian publishers. Based on this, I'd have to say no. How depressing! 

Technically the Chistian marketplace is defined as those books approved for distribution to the Christian market by Spring Arbor. This includes way more books than just those produced by publishers who serve the closed market CBA and ECPA serve. 

Christian Fiction examiner interview!

So nice when those who normally only report about happenings in the affiliated market of "Christian" fiction ask me for interviews or give a review. As a writer of horror/fantasy for the general market (Christians included,) I couldn't be more honored.

That being said, Shelly Ring is posting an ongoing interview with me on her Christian Fiction Examiner site. Do keep in mind that while anything Christian Fiction oriented is usually representative of what CBA and ECPA produce, I still do not belong to either of these affiliations. The work they produce is designed to appeal only to a very specific market of Christians and I write for the general market.

But I do "loves" having a LOT of their fans.

Thanks Shelly!!

Here's da link!

Also my work is still not actually Christian Speculative Fiction. That's just where many of my readers place it. It's general market Young Adult/horror/fantasy for the most part. You don't get short-listed for a Bram Stoker Award writing for a specific market of Christians. LOL

A most humbling review and recent!

A most humbling review and recent. If only those who should see it would see it but the chances of that are slim to nil. So for those of you who do read it be sure and pass it on. And for those who don't know Mr. Jon Guenther, hop over to his website at www.guenfire.com and check him out. He's written many novels and sold worldwide in large numbers. I can only hope to one day write as well as he does and to have my work sell as well as his does. Here's an excerpt from his Amazon review of Never Ceese click on it to read the review in it's entirety.

". . .In a manner eerily reminiscent of Mary Shelley's Frankenstein, but laced with a style that need make no apologies for its freshness, Sue Dent takes us on a grand tale of Richard the vampire and Ceese the werewolf . . ."

If you not read Jon Guenther's Soul Runner, your missing something fantastic!

Little known facts about the Christian publishing industry.

These are things I've learned along my journey. Since my blog seems to be visited mainly by aspiring authors and Christian ones at that, I thought I'd share in hopes of being helpful. In other words, if you want to hear about my books, don't bore yourself reading this. ;)

1. The larger Christian bookstores used to be the Baptist Bookstores and only carry fiction produced by fee paying CBA and ECPA affiliated publishers. They will occasionally allow non-affiliated published authors in when that author has made a monetary impact in the general Christian market. Very few books have achieved this status. C. S. Lewis is one and William P. Young is another. CBA was created in 1950 to serve a very conservative evangelical market excluding all other religious preferences and has only lately started looking at opening their doors to let affiliated authors write about other religions, usually in light of being a conservative evangelical though, for example Amish fiction written from a conservative evangelical world view or vampire fiction which isn't that at all since neither CBA or ECPA (a group of CBA affiliated publishers formed in the 70's) believe their core market readers want to read about vampires of lore or anything "demonic."

2. These larger Christian bookstores do not distinguish their market from the the general Christian market which is confusing or rather misleading IMO.

Click here to see who they view their market as:
http://www.usask.ca/relst/jrpc/art6-xianfiction.html There's a more understandable definition at cba.org.

3. Ingram purchased CBA's distributor Spring Arbor from them yet having your work accepted by Spring Arbor doesn't get you into larger Christian bookstores. However it did make it possible for CBA and ECPA affiliated publishers to flood general market bookstores with their highly targeted fiction. The merge upset many CBA and ECPA publishers because, according to blogs, they didn't feel Ingram understood their very targeted market. Many affiliated publishers threatened and did drop Spring Arbor as their distributor but seeing how things didn't really change all that much, they eventually came back, realizing that even if Spring Arbor was approving non-affiliated Christian work it didn't affect them. Larger Christian bookstore, both on-line and otherwise, still exclude and only place affiliated work.

4. Any blog tour, blogs, award etc . . . representing "the best in Christian Fiction" is generally only indicative of the best in CBA/ECPA Christian fiction.

6. General market publishing houses are just fine publishing stories written by authors who are Christians and do it all day long. However there seem to be many authors who write too "churchy" for a general market publisher and too "edgy" for CBA/ECPA publishers to touch.

7. Many affiliated published authors don't seem to think their publishers' affiliation has any bearing on them as an author. Sue Dent contends guilty by affiliation. Deal with it.

8. There are quite a few affiliated houses that do not advertise they are that. Here are a few major CBA or ECPA affiliated houses some operating as imprints of larger general market houses: Thomas Nelson, Waterbrook/Multnomah, Harvest House, Bethany House, Steeple Hill, Zondervan. For a more comprehensive list you can go to cba.org

I may add more as I experience them. ;)

Never Ceese makes the top three!

I was directed toward this blog this morning (Fr. Obregon dropped a link in my inbox) and couldn't have been happier! Oh . . . the link. ;)

Here ya go!

If you're a fan of mine, do go help promote! If you're not a fan yet, go check out the link. If you're Father Obregon, thanks again! You so rock!